A survey of 765

[iatbitw7]

A survey of 765 working women over eighteen years of age found that 60 percent of them worked 40 or
more hours a week and for married women with children under eighteen it was more likely that they
would work different shifts from their husbands

(A) for married women with children under eighteen it was more likely that they would work different
shifts from their husbands
(B) for married women whose children were under eighteen, they were more likely than other married
women to work shifts different from their husbands'
(C) when married women had children under eighteen it was more likely for them to be working different
shifts from those of their husbands'
(D) that married women with children under eighteen were more likely than other married women to work
shifts different from their husbands'
(E) that when married women had children under eighteen they were more likely to be working shifts that
differed from their husbands


i eliminate (a)(b)(c) because they are not parallel,but i want to know what's wrong with (e)

answer is (d)

[jnelson0612]

A survey of 765 working women over eighteen years of age found that 60 percent of them worked 40 or
more hours a week and for married women with children under eighteen it was more likely that they
would work different shifts from their husbands

(A) for married women with children under eighteen it was more likely that they would work different
shifts from their husbands
(B) for married women whose children were under eighteen, they were more likely than other married
women to work shifts different from their husbands'
(C) when married women had children under eighteen it was more likely for them to be working different
shifts from those of their husbands'
(D) that married women with children under eighteen were more likely than other married women to work
shifts different from their husbands'
(E) that when married women had children under eighteen they were more likely to be working shifts that
differed from their husbands


i eliminate (a)(b)(c) because they are not parallel,but i want to know what's wrong with (e)

answer is (d)

Well, one problem is a bad comparison:
"they were more likely to be working shifts that differed from their husbands"
So the "shifts" differed from the "husbands"? :-) No, the shifts differed from their husbands' shifts. You can imply this with just the possessive (husbands').

[iatbitw7]

i got it!!
thanks for explain

[tim]

:)

[eggpain24]

A survey of 765 working women over eighteen years of age found that 60 percent of them worked 40 or
more hours a week and for married women with children under eighteen it was more likely that they
would work different shifts from their husbands

(A) for married women with children under eighteen it was more likely that they would work different
shifts from their husbands
(B) for married women whose children were under eighteen, they were more likely than other married
women to work shifts different from their husbands'
(C) when married women had children under eighteen it was more likely for them to be working different
shifts from those of their husbands'
(D) that married women with children under eighteen were more likely than other married women to work
shifts different from their husbands'
(E) that when married women had children under eighteen they were more likely to be working shifts that
differed from their husbands


i eliminate (a)(b)(c) because they are not parallel,but i want to know what's wrong with (e)

answer is (d)

Hi, instructors, is the use of "when" in choice C and E problematic?

I think it is but I cannot articulate why it is wrong ( it just sounds weird by introducing some "conditional meaning" → it just only happens under certain condition）

[gmatkiller_24]

A survey of 765 working women over eighteen years of age found that 60 percent of them worked 40 or
more hours a week and for married women with children under eighteen it was more likely that they
would work different shifts from their husbands

(A) for married women with children under eighteen it was more likely that they would work different
shifts from their husbands
(B) for married women whose children were under eighteen, they were more likely than other married
women to work shifts different from their husbands'
(C) when married women had children under eighteen it was more likely for them to be working different
shifts from those of their husbands'
(D) that married women with children under eighteen were more likely than other married women to work
shifts different from their husbands'
(E) that when married women had children under eighteen they were more likely to be working shifts that
differed from their husbands


i eliminate (a)(b)(c) because they are not parallel,but i want to know what's wrong with (e)

answer is (d)

Hi, instructors, is the use of "when" in choice C and E problematic?

I think it is but I cannot articulate why it is wrong ( it just sounds weird by introducing some "conditional meaning" → it just only happens under certain condition）

same doubt here. Can experts comment on this issue? Thanks!

[RonPurewal]

the use of "when" here is weird, for sure, but it's not technically wrong.

it's weird because "when xxxxx, yyyyy" (or, equivalently, "yyyyy when xxxxx") is normally used only when "xxxxx" and "not xxxxx" are both legitimate possibilities.

typical example:
I don't like to do work when I'm sleepy
--> sometimes i'm sleepy; sometimes i'm not. at times when i'm sleepy, i dislike doing work.

since a woman either (a) has children under eighteen--a fact that remains true for at least 18 years straight--or (b) does not, the use of "when" here is just bad writing.
not an error (and thus not something for which you're responsible on this exam, but still bad writing. you won't find bad writing in the correct answers.

[RonPurewal]

... and, just in case this wasn't already clear: out of everything in the preceding post, the bold underlined part is the only thing that is actually important.

[sdfsdfsdfs481]

A survey of 765 working women over eighteen years of age found that 60 percent of them worked 40 or more hours a week and and that married women with children under eighteen were more likely than other married women to work shifts different from their husbands'

Question 1: Can the second that be omitted?


Since and is a parallel signal, the following sentences should be ok.
I like to eat an apple and an orange
I like to eat an apple and to eat an orange
So I thought the second that can be omitted. But It seems that in gmat the "that" cannot be omitted in such parallel. I can find this problem and the "they"(could refer women or children) ambiguity in (B).
Question 2: I'm not sure if these problems are rigid problems to say (B) is incorrect.

[RonPurewal]

in this example, good writing will contain both instances of 'that', because the two parts are so long that the sentence would be essentially unreadable without the second one.

this sentence would not be incorrect without the second 'that', but it would be bad writing. the correct answers won't contain needlessly bad writing.

since this is a style issue, it is a non-issue on this exam.

[RonPurewal]

also, i don't see how you're linking choice B to the issue above.

choice B contains 'For xxxxx, they do yyyyy'.
this construction is problematic here; if a sentence starts with 'for xxxxx' then its subject should NOT be 'xxxxx'.

this sentence uses 'for xxxxx' correctly:
For poor defendants who cannot afford private attorneys, an arrest is much more likely to lead to a jail sentence.
note that the subject of the following sentence is 'an arrest'. choice B doesn't work this way—it tries to use 'xxxxx' as the subject.

the whole issue of 'that ____ and that ____' vs. 'that ____ and ____' is completely irrelevant to choice B.

[sdfsdfsdfs481]

also, i don't see how you're linking choice B to the issue above.

choice B contains 'For xxxxx, they do yyyyy'.
this construction is problematic here; if a sentence starts with 'for xxxxx' then its subject should NOT be 'xxxxx'.

this sentence uses 'for xxxxx' correctly:
For poor defendants who cannot afford private attorneys, an arrest is much more likely to lead to a jail sentence.
note that the subject of the following sentence is 'an arrest'. choice B doesn't work this way—it tries to use 'xxxxx' as the subject.

the whole issue of 'that ____ and that ____' vs. 'that ____ and ____' is completely irrelevant to choice B.

My first question was can I eliminate (B) because there is no "that"?
The second one was that does the "they" have ambiguous problem (it could refers to women or children)?
for married women whose children were under eighteen, they were more likely than other married
women to work shifts different from their husbands

[RonPurewal]

My first question was can I eliminate (B) because there is no "that"?

no, not really.

there is a difference, but it's a VERY small one that is way, way beyond the scope of anything that this exam would ever test.

--- YOU DO NOT NEED TO KNOW THIS FOR THE EXAM ---

in general, to present 2 observations that are so closely related as to constitute a single observation with two components, a good writer will use just one 'that'.
e.g.,
Anthropologists studying Culture X have generally found that women stay home and men work.
--> the point here is that 'women stay home and men work' isn't really two separate observations. this is more like one observation, because the two parts are so complementary / closely related to each other.

vs.
Anthropologists studying Culture X have generally found that nearly all children play competitive sports and that no one eats a vegetarian diet.
--> these are two separate, basically independent observations, so a good writer will use 'that' twice.

again, this is clearly a VERY small difference; this exam NEVER relies on such subtleties. if you're focusing on something like this, you're probably failing to see (or, worse, ignoring) something much bigger and easier to decide.

--- YOU DO NOT NEED TO KNOW THIS FOR THE EXAM ---

[RonPurewal]

The second one was that does the "they" have ambiguous problem (it could refers to women or children)?

no. it is perfectly obvious that 'they' = 'married women with kids under 18'.

the problem here is as described above ('for xxxx' is incompatible with 'they').

[sdfsdfsdfs481]

The second one was that does the "they" have ambiguous problem (it could refers to women or children)?

no. it is perfectly obvious that 'they' = 'married women with kids under 18'.

the problem here is as described above ('for xxxx' is incompatible with 'they').

Thank you.