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ikuta.yamahashi
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Re: Even though it was not illegal for the bank to share

by ikuta.yamahashi Sat Feb 02, 2013 8:16 am

Dear instructor:

In BCDE there are too many its
its failure ... its promise ... its customers
Is it structure fatally awkward?
May I eliminate all of them only by this reason?

Yours
Ikuta
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Re: Even though it was not illegal for the bank to share

by tim Mon Feb 04, 2013 9:35 am

There is nothing wrong with an answer choice sounding "wordy" or "awkward". In fact, I have NEVER seen a GMAT problem for which the only way to eliminate an answer is awkwardness. If you ever use the phrase "wordy and awkward" (or anything else that sounds similar) to explain your reasoning on a SC question, you have done something wrong. If you are willing to eliminate an answer choice because it is awkward, you may end up eliminating the correct choice. There is ALWAYS a real reason why SC answer choices are wrong, and "wordy and awkward" is NEVER that reason. Please note that if you read an explanation that uses the words "awkward" or "wordy", that explanation is wrong - EVEN IF IT IS A DIRECT QUOTE FROM THE OFFICIAL GUIDE.
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Re: Even though it was not illegal for the bank to share

by ikuta.yamahashi Mon Feb 04, 2013 10:32 am

Thanks Tim,
I'll keep this word.:)
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Re: Even though it was not illegal for the bank to share

by thanghnvn Mon Feb 04, 2013 11:39 am

to engage in somthing by doing something

is idiom

only this idiom can eliminate all choices b,c,d and e.

however, "possessive+noun of action" is not used when the use of "doing" is clear enough to show who do the action of "doing" . Of course, when there is no noun and there is only "doing" such as "learning" , we have to use possessive+doing.
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Re: Even though it was not illegal for the bank to share

by tim Mon Feb 04, 2013 3:41 pm

i'd recommend avoiding idioms wherever possible as well. at any rate, idioms should be the VERY LAST grammar issue you address on any SC question, because you can never be sure what the GMAT is thinking.. :)
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Re: Even though it was not illegal for the bank to share

by SC312 Fri Aug 02, 2013 12:28 pm

Experts,

Can you please explain the correct answer and let me know where am I wrong in my interpretation of the correct answer choice

..... the state's attorney general accused the bank of engaging in deceptive business practices by failing to honor its promise to its customers to keep records private.

I believe "by failing" is a prepositional modifier working as an adverb, modifying the verb accused. Doesn't it mean that "the state's attorney general accused by failing to honor its promise to its customers to keep records private" rather than the than bank itself is failing to honor its promise ?


Thanks
Sudipto
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Re: Even though it was not illegal for the bank to share

by RonPurewal Tue Aug 06, 2013 7:10 am

SC312 Wrote:Experts,

Can you please explain the correct answer and let me know where am I wrong in my interpretation of the correct answer choice

..... the state's attorney general accused the bank of engaging in deceptive business practices by failing to honor its promise to its customers to keep records private.

I believe "by failing" is a prepositional modifier working as an adverb, modifying the verb accused.


no, it modifies the action "engaging in deceptive business practices", which makes perfect sense in context.

don't make the mistake of thinking that adverbs must modify verbs -- they can modify other forms of actions, too.
e.g.,
Lying lazily on the beach is very relaxing.
--> here, "lazily" modifies the action "lying", even though "lying" is technically a noun here. but, it's still an action.

I like to lie lazily on the beach.
--> here, "lazily" modifies "to lie", which isn't a verb either.

same deal here.
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Re: Even though it was not illegal for the bank to share

by divineacclivity Wed Jun 11, 2014 1:45 pm

RonPurewal Wrote:
dr_o Wrote:can anyone please explain why E is wrong?
Thanks


two things:
(1) incorrect idiom: 'promise of keeping' is wrong. the correct form is 'promise to keep'.
(2) change in meaning: the correct meaning is what appears in the original sentence, namely, that the failure to honor promises WAS the deceptive business practice. choice e, with its use of 'because', implies that the failure to keep promises LED TO (other) deceptive business practices. remember that you have to interpret words like 'because' very, very literally.


Ron,

I couldn't understand the meaning at first but by reading your explanations again and again, I understood the following; could you please confirm its correctness? Thank you very much in advance.

I made a horrible mistake by assuming it wasn't going to rain today.
--> Assuming - it wouldn't rain - was the mistake

I made a horrible mistake because I assumed it wasn't going to rain today.
--> I made some mistake (maybe, in my worksheet/calculations) because I assumed it wouldn't rain (maybe, for my calculations/formulae, coefficient for a sunny-day was different from that of a rainy-day) i.e. my assumption made me make a mistake in my work or something.

I made a horrible mistake, assuming it wasn't going to rain today.
--> Only if the assumption happens to be true, I would be accused of a mistake.
A better suited sentence would be:
I would attend the party, assuming I catch today's last bus to the party place.

I made a mistake assuming it wasn't going to rain today. (note: there's no comma before 'assuming')
--> utterly wrong because the sentence says mistake assumes <something>
A correct sentence of this sort should be:
Moly saw a dog running after a car (dog is running in this case)

I made a mistake by assumption of rainfall today.
(as in option B: by its failure of honoring its promise to its customers to keep)
--> wrong 'by' needs a verb+ing and not a noun
thank you for your useful feedback always.
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Re:

by thanghnvn Thu Jun 12, 2014 12:19 am

[quote="Sputnik"]Even though it was not illegal for the bank to share its customers' personal and financial information with an outside marketing company in return for a commission on sales, the state's attorney general accused the bank of engaging in deceptive business practices //by failing to honor its promise to its customers to keep //records private.
A. by failing to honor its promise to its customers to keep
B. by its failure of honoring its promise to its customers to keep
C. in its failing to honor its promise to its customers of keeping
D. because of its failure in honoring its promise to its customers in keeping
E. because of its failure to honor its promise to its customers of keeping

this question is about idiom

promise to do something
promise of something (not promise of doing something)

there are two idioms of promise. very clear.

failure to do something. this is idiom.

"because of its failure" is correct but this phrase shows a reason. we need to show the method ,not the reason, of the previous action . this is meaning test, typical of gmat sc.
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Re: Even though it was not illegal for the bank to share

by thanghnvn Thu Jun 12, 2014 12:27 am

I made a mistake by assumption of rainfall today.
(as in option B: by its failure of honoring its promise to its customers to keep)
--> wrong 'by' needs a verb+ing and not a noun
thank you for your useful feedback always.

nope.

to talk about how the main verb is done we can use by, or with

main verb+by+action (action is not needed to shown by doing)
main verb+witn+something.

the two points above is basic grammar explained in grammar books.

I talk about the point 1.

I make mistake by assumption of rainfall today.

this is wrong because "assumption " refer to a general action not because "by" must be followed by "doing".

the following is correct

I make mistake by my assumption of rainfall today.

however , this is wordy because we can use assuming for shorter sentence.

I make mistake by assumming rainfall today. in this sentence "assumming" refer to "I" which is the agent of action "assumming" .

am I correct ?
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Re: Even though it was not illegal for the bank to share

by thanghnvn Thu Jun 12, 2014 12:30 am

I think both the following sentences are correct

I made mistakes by assumming rainfall today
I made mistakes, assumming rainfall today

am I correct.
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Re: Even though it was not illegal for the bank to share

by RonPurewal Thu Jun 12, 2014 4:03 am

divineacclivity Wrote:
RonPurewal Wrote:
dr_o Wrote:can anyone please explain why E is wrong?
Thanks


two things:
(1) incorrect idiom: 'promise of keeping' is wrong. the correct form is 'promise to keep'.
(2) change in meaning: the correct meaning is what appears in the original sentence, namely, that the failure to honor promises WAS the deceptive business practice. choice e, with its use of 'because', implies that the failure to keep promises LED TO (other) deceptive business practices. remember that you have to interpret words like 'because' very, very literally.


Ron,

I couldn't understand the meaning at first but by reading your explanations again and again, I understood the following; could you please confirm its correctness? Thank you very much in advance.

I made a horrible mistake by assuming it wasn't going to rain today.
--> Assuming - it wouldn't rain - was the mistake

I made a horrible mistake because I assumed it wasn't going to rain today.
--> I made some mistake (maybe, in my worksheet/calculations) because I assumed it wouldn't rain (maybe, for my calculations/formulae, coefficient for a sunny-day was different from that of a rainy-day) i.e. my assumption made me make a mistake in my work or something.

I made a horrible mistake, assuming it wasn't going to rain today.
--> Only if the assumption happens to be true, I would be accused of a mistake.
A better suited sentence would be:
I would attend the party, assuming I catch today's last bus to the party place.

I made a mistake assuming it wasn't going to rain today. (note: there's no comma before 'assuming')
--> utterly wrong because the sentence says mistake assumes <something>
A correct sentence of this sort should be:
Moly saw a dog running after a car (dog is running in this case)

I made a mistake by assumption of rainfall today.
(as in option B: by its failure of honoring its promise to its customers to keep)
--> wrong 'by' needs a verb+ing and not a noun
thank you for your useful feedback always.


This looks quite good.

You've certainly progressed beyond the level of understanding required for this exam. Well done.
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Re: Re:

by RonPurewal Thu Jun 12, 2014 4:06 am

thanghnvn Wrote:"because of its failure" is correct but this phrase shows a reason. we need to show the method ,not the reason, of the previous action . this is meaning test, typical of gmat sc.


Just to clarify,
"Because of its failure" implies that the failure caused the bank to subsequently engage in deceptive practices.

The sentence is intended to express the idea that the failure was the deceptive practice. "Because" doesn't express that idea.
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Re: Even though it was not illegal for the bank to share

by RonPurewal Thu Jun 12, 2014 4:07 am

thanghnvn Wrote:the following is correct

I make mistake by my assumption of rainfall today.


This is not correct, for reasons explained by divineacclivity above.
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Re: Even though it was not illegal for the bank to share

by divineacclivity Fri Jun 13, 2014 3:52 am

RonPurewal Wrote:
This looks quite good.

You've certainly progressed beyond the level of understanding required for this exam. Well done.


Thank you, Ron.
You can't imagine how much your comment means to a student like me, specially when it comes form a guru or a master like you.