Complex human traits such as artistic talent or social skill

[tankobe]

Complex human traits such as artistic talent or social skill are likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80,000 or so genes in the human genome.

(A) such as artistic talent or social skill are likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80,000 or so
(B) such as artistic talent or social skill are likely shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of 80,000 or so of the
(C) such as artistic talent or social skill is likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of 80,000 or so of the
(D) like artistic talent or social skill is likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80,000 or so
(E) like artistic talent or social skill are likely shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80,000 or so

source: GMATPrep2 OA is A
I can pick up the OA, but i just want to know what of the in B is supposed to mean!

[RonPurewal]

Complex human traits such as artistic talent or social skill are likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80,000 or so genes in the human genome.

(A) such as artistic talent or social skill are likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80,000 or so
(B) such as artistic talent or social skill are likely shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of 80,000 or so of the
(C) such as artistic talent or social skill is likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of 80,000 or so of the
(D) like artistic talent or social skill is likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80,000 or so
(E) like artistic talent or social skill are likely shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80,000 or so

source: GMATPrep2 OA is A
I can pick up the OA, but i just want to know what of the in B is supposed to mean!

remember that (b) is one of the wrong answers; proceed accordingly.

"NUMBER of the PLURAL NOUN" means that there are more than NUMBER of these NOUNs.

for instance, if i say "80,000 of the people at the stadium", then there must have been more than 80,000 people at the stadium (and i happen to be talking about some subset consisting of 80,000 of them).

--

you can also confidently cross off (b) because it contains the construction "X of Y of Z".
they don't include repeated prepositions like that in non-parallel structures.

for more on that topic, see:

post35013.html#p35013

post35020.html#p35020

[tankobe]

thanks, ron! it is aways your explanation that make me more clear.

[RonPurewal]

thanks, ron! it is aways your explanation that make me more clear.

glad it helped

[zarak_khan]

Complex human traits such as artistic talent or social skill are likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80.000 or so genes in the human genome.
A. such as artistic talent or social skill are likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80,000 or so
B. such as artistic talent or social skill are likely shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of 80,000 or so of the
C. such as artistic talent or social skill is likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of 80,000 or so of the
D. like artistic talent or social skill is likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80,000 or so
E. like artistic talent or social skill are likely shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80,000 or so

Hi Ron,

I couldn't decide between A and E. I understand A has "such as" for examples but it also contains "to be" which means this sentence is refering to something in the future. Choice E on the other hand talks about something that has been happening and continues to happen. Since we are talking about human traits, I went with option E. I am not questioing the official answer here but am not sure how I could avoid such a mistake in the official test.........

Thanks!

[RonPurewal]

Complex human traits such as artistic talent or social skill are likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80.000 or so genes in the human genome.
A. such as artistic talent or social skill are likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80,000 or so
B. such as artistic talent or social skill are likely shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of 80,000 or so of the
C. such as artistic talent or social skill is likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of 80,000 or so of the
D. like artistic talent or social skill is likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80,000 or so
E. like artistic talent or social skill are likely shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80,000 or so

Hi Ron,

I couldn't decide between A and E. I understand A has "such as" for examples but it also contains "to be" which means this sentence is refering to something in the future. Choice E on the other hand talks about something that has been happening and continues to happen. Since we are talking about human traits, I went with option E. I am not questioing the official answer here but am not sure how I could avoid such a mistake in the official test.........

Thanks!

this is an excellent point, which reflects an unusually deep knowledge of the meaning behind english verb tenses.

however, there are two things to realize here:

1) you are correct in asserting that choices (a) and (e) have two different meanings. however, both of these meanings are reasonable:
(a) implies an aspect of probability -- i.e., these genes may or may not shape the traits in question.
(e) implies a degree of certainty -- i.e., there are definite genes that shape these traits, without the element of probability/uncertainties suggested in choice (a).

both of these are reasonable, although i ultimately agree with you that (e) is probably a little bit more reasonable than (a).
however, there's just no way that such a subtle difference would be dispositive on a gmat question -- it's just too small of a difference, and it also demands a pretty deep understanding of genes and their functionality. (remember that this test is expressly designed not to require any specialized outside knowledge.)

also:
2) "such as" is definitely superior to "like" here.

still, this is one of those problems that serves as a learning opportunity regarding how the gmat functions.

[pratapravi.singh19]

Can you pleas tell which parts of the sentences are mapping the 'X OF Y OF Z' construction. I'm getting confused because of the words in between commas. Should they be considered as well?

(A) such as artistic talent or social skill are likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80,000 or so
X of Y of Z
X of thousands, of the 80K

(B) such as artistic talent or social skill are likely shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of 80,000 or so of the
X of Y of Z or so of K
X of thousands, of 80K or so of the
Isn't the 'or so of K' a part of Z....so essentially it is only
X of Y of Z

So why is A right? Please clarify.

[RonPurewal]

Can you pleas tell which parts of the sentences are mapping the 'X OF Y OF Z' construction. I'm getting confused because of the words in between commas. Should they be considered as well?

two things

* in general, those kinds of constructions are considered "awkward" when they are unbroken -- i.e., when they are in one piece, without any punctuation (such as commas) breaking them up.

* also, "tens of thousands" is a single number; this shouldn't really be considered a prepositional phrase. (it's equivalent to "millions" or "thousands"; there isn't a single word for this kind of number.)

[aliassad]

i chose the correct answer A but still would like to know if we can cross out options on the basis of "likely to be shaped by" vs. "likely shaped by"


The latter sounds awkward to me.


Thanks in advance.

[RonPurewal]

i chose the correct answer A but still would like to know if we can cross out options on the basis of "likely to be shaped by" vs. "likely shaped by"

The latter sounds awkward to me.

Thanks in advance.

"likely" can be an adverb; i don't think the latter version is problematic.

[AbhilashM94]

hi ron,

looks like the main reason to eliminate/split is,

such as vs. like.

In this problem, since we are talking about artistic talent and social traits 0 both human traits but unrelated, is this why we can use like.

Maybe only talents and skills are affected by genome.
I'n not exactly 100% convinced on how there are used as examples in this problem.

Can you help?

[jlucero]

hi ron,

looks like the main reason to eliminate/split is,

such as vs. like.

In this problem, since we are talking about artistic talent and social traits 0 both human traits but unrelated, is this why we can use like.

Maybe only talents and skills are affected by genome.
I'n not exactly 100% convinced on how there are used as examples in this problem.

Can you help?

Maybe I don't understand your question, but the correct answer choice uses such as, not like.

Such as is preferable when listing examples of something.
Like is preferable when mentioning things that are similar.

[RonPurewal]

I think the poster may have intended to write "...can't use like". (If A and B are totally different things, then it's not reasonable to posit the existence of something that is "like A and B".)

If that wasn't the poster's intention, then the poster accidentally made a good point.
(:

[eggpain24]

Complex human traits such as artistic talent or social skill are likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80.000 or so genes in the human genome.
A. such as artistic talent or social skill are likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80,000 or so
B. such as artistic talent or social skill are likely shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of 80,000 or so of the
C. such as artistic talent or social skill is likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of 80,000 or so of the
D. like artistic talent or social skill is likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80,000 or so
E. like artistic talent or social skill are likely shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80,000 or so

Hi Ron,

I couldn't decide between A and E. I understand A has "such as" for examples but it also contains "to be" which means this sentence is refering to something in the future. Choice E on the other hand talks about something that has been happening and continues to happen. Since we are talking about human traits, I went with option E. I am not questioing the official answer here but am not sure how I could avoid such a mistake in the official test.........

Thanks!

this is an excellent point, which reflects an unusually deep knowledge of the meaning behind english verb tenses.

however, there are two things to realize here:

1) you are correct in asserting that choices (a) and (e) have two different meanings. however, both of these meanings are reasonable:
(a) implies an aspect of probability -- i.e., these genes may or may not shape the traits in question.
(e) implies a degree of certainty -- i.e., there are definite genes that shape these traits, without the element of probability/uncertainties suggested in choice (a).

both of these are reasonable, although i ultimately agree with you that (e) is probably a little bit more reasonable than (a).
however, there's just no way that such a subtle difference would be dispositive on a gmat question -- it's just too small of a difference, and it also demands a pretty deep understanding of genes and their functionality. (remember that this test is expressly designed not to require any specialized outside knowledge.)

also:
2) "such as" is definitely superior to "like" here.

still, this is one of those problems that serves as a learning opportunity regarding how the gmat functions.

really fantastic point！

[eggpain24]

Complex human traits such as artistic talent or social skill are likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80,000 or so genes in the human genome.

(A) such as artistic talent or social skill are likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80,000 or so
(B) such as artistic talent or social skill are likely shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of 80,000 or so of the
(C) such as artistic talent or social skill is likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of 80,000 or so of the
(D) like artistic talent or social skill is likely to be shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80,000 or so
(E) like artistic talent or social skill are likely shaped by thousands, if not tens of thousands, of the 80,000 or so

source: GMATPrep2 OA is A
I can pick up the OA, but i just want to know what of the in B is supposed to mean!

HI,ron

I just wonder whether the construction in choice B change the meaning
"if not tens of thousands, of 80,000 or so of the"


What the originally meaning in correct choice is that → we have 80,000 genes, part of which or all of which might influence human traits

but in choice B ,with the repeated appearance of "of the"

the meaning becomes 80,000("so" refer to 80,000) of genes → the total number of genes is higher than 80,000