Comma + Like, After the clause.

[JbhB682]

Hello Experts - i recently came across a comparison problem that hinged on placement of 'Like' within the context of comparisons

Was curious, which sentences do you think are okay

(i) Sam hates Toronto, like NYC
(ii) Sam hates Toronto, like Adam
(iii) Sam, like Adam, hates Toronto
(iv) Sam hates Toronto like NYC
(v) Sam hates Toronto like Adam

..........

[JbhB682]

(i) I think this okay because there is no ambiguity
- Sam hates Toronto like how Sam hates NYC

(ii) I think this is wrong because there are 2 meanings
- Sam hates Toronto like how Adam hates Toronto
or
- Sam hates Toronto like how Sam hates Adam

(iii) This i know is good beacuse in this case there is only one logical interpretation
Sam and Adam BOTH hate toronto

(iv) Here no comma before Like.... I am not sure about this
I think this maybe is okay because there is 1 meaning only
i.e. Sam hates Toronto like how Sam hates NYC


(v) Here no comma before Like.... I think this is wrong because there are 2 meanings
- Sam hates Toronto like how Adam hates Toronto
or
- Sam hates Toronto like how Sam hates Adam

[TiffanyB]

(i) Sam hates Toronto, like NYC

.

Incorrect. This one is not correct, because the comparison is that Sam hates both Toronto and NYC. As it currently reads, either Sam hates Toronto and NYC OR Sam hates Toronto and NYC hates Toronto.

A better way to state this is: Same hates Toronto as he does NYC.

Note the change to AS instead of LIKE; AS is used to compare clauses whereas LIKE is used to compare nouns.

(ii) Sam hates Toronto, like Adam

Incorrect. You're correct that this version also has two meanings. Like the first option, this option is still comparing clauses, so it would be correct to use AS instead of LIKE along with some clarification.

Sam hates Toronto as does Adam (correctly written) OR Sam hates Toronto as Sam hates Adam (correctly written).

(iii) Sam, like Adam, hates Toronto

Correct. Sam, like Adam compares Sam and Adam instead of Sam hating. Like is the correct word to use in this case because NOUNS are being compared.

(iv) Sam hates Toronto like NYC

Incorrect. This one is similar to option 1, as you note. This option would also need to use AS instead of LIKE as a clause is being compared (Adam hates X as he does Y.]

(v) Sam hates Toronto like Adam

Incorrect. This option is incorrect for the same reasons as option 2.

[JbhB682]

Thanks so much Tiffany for responding. Just focussing on (i) only for example -

(i) Sam hates Toronto, like NYC

.

Incorrect. This one is not correct, because the comparison is that Sam hates both Toronto and NYC. As it currently reads, either Sam hates Toronto and NYC OR Sam hates Toronto and NYC hates Toronto.

You mention in the green text -- there are 2 interpretations for (i)

I agree.

[JbhB682]

^^

interpretation a) Sam hates Toronto and Sam hates NYC

interpetation b) Sam hates Toronto and NYC hates Toronto

Now taking this ONE STEP FURTHER -- obviously interpretation # b is bogus. Interepration b doesn't make sense because how can NYC hate Toronto.

Hence, you are LEFT WITH ONLY interpretation (i.e. interpretation #a)

Thus, shouldnt you once you lay out the two interepretation -- also ask

hmm can interpretation #a and interpretation #b be viable ?

if (#b) is not viable, (#a) is the only viable meaning for sentence (i)

Hence i thought -- sentence (i) was okay because one can eliminate interepreation (b) between the 2 viable intereprations and thus you are left with interpretation (a)

Thoughts ?

[abaltao1]

It's so hard for me sometimes to understand and remember all these rules. And when I write college papers, I especially notice it.

[abaltao1]

It's so hard for me sometimes to understand and remember all these rules. And when I write college papers, I especially notice it.

[ScottD643]

(ii) Sam hates Toronto, like Adam

Incorrect. You're correct that this version also has two meanings. Like the first option, this option is still comparing clauses, so it would be correct to use AS instead of LIKE along with some clarification.

Greetings.

I do not have the new edition, so I am basing this post on the information in the prior edition, chapter 11, “More on Like vs As.”

I realize that the output by GMAC is in a constant state of flux. Therefore, I want to ensure that I am following the correct Grammar Rule (as per GMAC’s conception of “Grammar Rules”)

1. Ambiguous: I want to coach divers LIKE Greg Louganis.

2 possible interpretations:

I want to coach divers who are like Greg L.

Or

I want to coach divers in the same way as Greg L coaches divers.

2. UNAMBIGUOUS
I want to coach divers, like Greg Louganis. (Note the comma before like)

This sentence conveys the meaning of: LIKE Greg L., I want to coach divers. (He coaches divers; I want to do so)

Based on this interpretation, wouldn’t example (II) be a correct noun-to-noun comparison? Or has the guideline shifted in the newer questions?

Edit: apologies, I have one further question.

At the top of the section quoted above, the following guideline is presented:

“Like can be used to modify a noun or a verb, creating a comparison. Remember, only nouns or pronouns can follow like.”

I always understood the usage of “like” as follows:

I believe the two correct example cited were:

“Like you, I danced last night.”

And

“I danced like you last night.”

I was under the impression that since “like” is a preposition, a noun or noun phrase must follow. However, the basis of comparison can still be an action of a verb, even though the two compared elements are nouns.

Is this an incorrect understanding of the usage of “like” vs “as”?

[Whit Garner]

First, the good news (actually, it's great news): The GMAT will NOT test you on anything this nuanced! So if you're worried about the test, you can stop reading here

That said, let's look at your questions.

First, the version you included as "unambiguous" is certainly LESS ambiguous than the first one BUT my assumption is that you want to coach divers LIKE him… (meaning that you want to coach divers who are similar in nature to Greg L). If that's the case, use such as (the GMAT will).

As to whether the comma helps, we can definitely have an interesting intellectual conversations about this, but once again this is absolutely not tested by the GMAT (so stop reading now if you're more concerned with the test itself). Interesting intellectual conversation about this.

Let's use the following examples:

“Like you, I danced last night.” → we both danced last night! Note that this would be clear, but we don’t talk like this in common American english

vs.

“I danced like you last night.” → in common usage this would likely mean that I went out and danced pretending I was you (or at least trying to dance in the way you danced - like I was imitating or channeling your energy. This isn't entirely clear, though, as I'm not sure whether you were there dancing or not. BUT this is often how we talk.

In all cases, it can be BOTH the placement and the comma that impact meaning. I think the biggest focus is more that I'll use "like" when I'm trying to specifically compare the nouns: "Bees, like wasps, are social creatures". We're directly comparing the Bees to the Wasps. But we use "as" if we're comparing the action more directly: "Bees live in communities, as do wasps" or "Bees live in communities, as wasps do."

[ScottD643]

Thank you for the response.

I really do need to get the updated “All the Verbal” guide. The “Greg Louganis” examples were copied from the prior Manhattan Prep guide before “All the Verbal” was released (I didn’t exactly make that abundantly clear lol).

The examples I quoted from the prior guide never sat well with what (I thought) I understood. I couldn’t (and still can’t) imagine an official explanation delving into the nuances of comma placement.

I do recall one official question in which a “comma + like” appeared at the end of the clause. It may be the official question that prompted the original poster to ask his or her question.

In any event, thank you for your time.

All the best!

First, the good news (actually, it's great news): The GMAT will NOT test you on anything this nuanced! So if you're worried about the test, you can stop reading here

That said, let's look at your questions.

First, the version you included as "unambiguous" is certainly LESS ambiguous than the first one BUT my assumption is that you want to coach divers LIKE him… (meaning that you want to coach divers who are similar in nature to Greg L). If that's the case, use such as (the GMAT will).

As to whether the comma helps, we can definitely have an interesting intellectual conversations about this, but once again this is absolutely not tested by the GMAT (so stop reading now if you're more concerned with the test itself). Interesting intellectual conversation about this.

Let's use the following examples:

“Like you, I danced last night.” → we both danced last night! Note that this would be clear, but we don’t talk like this in common American english

vs.

“I danced like you last night.” → in common usage this would likely mean that I went out and danced pretending I was you (or at least trying to dance in the way you danced - like I was imitating or channeling your energy. This isn't entirely clear, though, as I'm not sure whether you were there dancing or not. BUT this is often how we talk.

In all cases, it can be BOTH the placement and the comma that impact meaning. I think the biggest focus is more that I'll use "like" when I'm trying to specifically compare the nouns: "Bees, like wasps, are social creatures". We're directly comparing the Bees to the Wasps. But we use "as" if we're comparing the action more directly: "Bees live in communities, as do wasps" or "Bees live in communities, as wasps do."

[Whit Garner]

So glad to help!