According to a study published by Dr. Myrna Weissman

[jjykim]

According to a study published by Dr. Myrna Weissman, only one percent of Americans born before 1905 had suffered major depression by the age of seventy-five; of those born since 1955, six percent had become depressed by age twenty-four.

(A) only one percent of Americans born before 1905 had suffered major depression by the age of seventy-five; of those born since 1955, six percent had become depressed by age twenty-four
(B) only one percent of Americans born before 1905 suffer major depression by the age of seventy-five; if they are born since 1955, six percent become depressed by age twenty-four
(C) of Americans born before 1905, only one percent of them have suffered major depression by age seventy-five, but six percent of those born since 1955 do by the age of twenty-four
(D) major depression is suffered by the age of seventy-five by only one percent of Americans born before 1905, and by age twenty-four by the six percent born since 1955
(E) Americans born before 1905 suffer major depression by the age of seventy-five only one percent of the time, but six percent of those born since 1955 did so by age twenty-four

The correct answer is A. I wasn't sure why the sentence made use of the past perfect in this problem. Is it because the suffering happened before the study was published?

[Raj]

Hi,

good one. I tried process of elimination to arrive at A.

Regarding the past perfect tense, the only explanation I could come up with is that they were depressed before they turned 24, both of which are in the past.

-Raj.

According to a study published by Dr. Myrna Weissman, only one percent of Americans born before 1905 had suffered major depression by the age of seventy-five; of those born since 1955, six percent had become depressed by age twenty-four.

(A) only one percent of Americans born before 1905 had suffered major depression by the age of seventy-five; of those born since 1955, six percent had become depressed by age twenty-four
(B) only one percent of Americans born before 1905 suffer major depression by the age of seventy-five; if they are born since 1955, six percent become depressed by age twenty-four
(C) of Americans born before 1905, only one percent of them have suffered major depression by age seventy-five, but six percent of those born since 1955 do by the age of twenty-four
(D) major depression is suffered by the age of seventy-five by only one percent of Americans born before 1905, and by age twenty-four by the six percent born since 1955
(E) Americans born before 1905 suffer major depression by the age of seventy-five only one percent of the time, but six percent of those born since 1955 did so by age twenty-four

The correct answer is A. I wasn't sure why the sentence made use of the past perfect in this problem. Is it because the suffering happened before the study was published?

[jjykim]

that's what I thought too...thanks.

[RonPurewal]

Regarding the past perfect tense, the only explanation I could come up with is that they were depressed before they turned 24, both of which are in the past.

correct.
more properly, the relevance of their having become depressed had not yet expired by the time they turned 24 - the implication here is that there's some sort of ongoing relevance.
it wouldn't be wrong to write "became depressed by the age of 24", using the simple past, but that construction wouldn't capture the same sense of relevance. as usual, though, the test will not make you choose between 2 grammatically and semantically viable options.

[Sam]

:?

Ron,

Can you explain more clearly why past perfect is needed? What are the two actions that started in the past?

Published is one action and the suffered/depressed is another action?

I looked at the years. Before 1905 means clearly by 2008/09 every one must be 75+ years old. I can understand the past tense

But since 1955 can mean any thing after 55 and not every one is 24+ years. How can we use past perfect here?

Thanks

[RonPurewal]

But since 1955 can mean any thing after 55 and not every one is 24+ years. How can we use past perfect here?

Thanks

in a study of the conditions that have afflicted individuals "by the age of twenty-four", all of the study's participants clearly must be at least 24 years old. otherwise, "by the age of twenty-four" would be nonsense.

analogy:
you can't ask college freshmen what they have and haven't done by the time they graduate from college.
"by the time of your college graduation" is only a meaningful concept for people who have actually graduated from college.

[tankobe]

According to a study published by Dr. Myrna Weissman, only one percent of Americans born before 1905 had suffered major depression by the age of seventy-five; of those born since 1955, six percent had become depressed by age twenty-four.

what is really according to the study? only one percent of Americans born before 1905 had suffered major depression by the age of seventy-five or of those born since 1955, six percent had become depressed by age twenty-four, or both?
in another words, According to pharse can modify the clause after the ; ?[ i am not questioning the validity of the answer key; i just want whether i write the same sentence in future!]

[RonPurewal]

According to a study published by Dr. Myrna Weissman, only one percent of Americans born before 1905 had suffered major depression by the age of seventy-five; of those born since 1955, six percent had become depressed by age twenty-four.

what is really according to the study? only one percent of Americans born before 1905 had suffered major depression by the age of seventy-five or of those born since 1955, six percent had become depressed by age twenty-four, or both?
in another words, According to pharse can modify the clause after the ; ?[ i am not questioning the validity of the answer key; i just want whether i write the same sentence in future!]

yeah.

this is more a matter of necessity than anything else. think about the ways in which studies are quoted.
while many sources only quote studies in small blurbs and sound-bites, it's quite common for sources to include several paragraphs, or pages, describing the same study. imagine if they had to write "according to the same study, ..." in front of every single sentence.

[tankobe]

yeah.

this is more a matter of necessity than anything else. think about the ways in which studies are quoted.
while many sources only quote studies in small blurbs and sound-bites, it's quite common for sources to include several paragraphs, or pages, describing the same study. imagine if they had to write "according to the same study, ..." in front of every single sentence.

the explanation does work!

[sandeep.19+man]

(C) of Americans born before 1905, only one percent of them have suffered major depression by age seventy-five, but six percent of those born since 1955 do by the age of twenty-four

1. According to a study published by Dr. Myrna Weissman, of Americans born before 1905, only one percent ....

Is the above structure wrong or is it just a less preferred way of writing as per GMAT. i.e. I'd like to know whether the above structure can be considered correct if and when all the other 4 options are wrong?

2. Is the use of "do" in C correct?

Thank you

[gauravkapoor08]

C is not correct.
1. It starts with "of Americans born before 1905", which makes the use of "of them" abosultely wrong
2. "have suffered" is wrong since this happened in past
3. "by age seventy-five" is not correct as well

Option A takes care of these problems.

Use of "do" is not correct as this "do" makes it a present event. Actually, this sentence includes only those participants who have crossed this age.

[RonPurewal]

C is not correct.
1. It starts with "of Americans born before 1905", which makes the use of "of them" abosultely wrong
2. "have suffered" is wrong since this happened in past
3. "by age seventy-five" is not correct as well

Option A takes care of these problems.

Use of "do" is not correct as this "do" makes it a present event. Actually, this sentence includes only those participants who have crossed this age.

this is a good post.

the only thing in here that may not be correct is your #3.
in most sources of written english, "by the age of N" and "by age N" are both acceptable -- but, as usual, it's only the official verdict that matters.
do you have any official justification for claiming that this construction is incorrect?

[mkurteev123]

hi Ron
in MSC book 4-edition page 110
it is written that we don`t need to use Past Perfect if we have words such as Before and After as they clearly indicate that order of events, but in A, Past Perfect and Before coexist both, can you please clarify,
and one more E is incorrect because of Simple Present-suffer, while suffered is needed, or because of any other mistakes?
thanks

[RonPurewal]

hi Ron
in MSC book 4-edition page 110
it is written that we don`t need to use Past Perfect if we have words such as Before and After as they clearly indicate that order of events, but in A, Past Perfect and Before coexist both, can you please clarify,

first, this example isn't like the example on that page. in this example, "before" exists in the expression born before 1905, which is just a modifier; this expression doesn't play an active role in the time sequence of the actions in this sentence.

second, that claim isn't entirely correct anyway; we should edit that to be more specific.
in a sequence of two independent actions (such as "laura locked the door before she left the house"), the actions should be in the same tense. this isn't a function of the signal word "before" as much as it's a function of sentences that describe sequences of independent actions.
if a sentence describes a condition that was pre-existing and lasted up until a given action, it's perfectly possible to use "before" with the past perfect:
before linda told me about the Purple Monster, i had never heard of it.

and one more E is incorrect because of Simple Present-suffer, while suffered is needed, or because of any other mistakes?
thanks

that's an error, yes.
two more errors:
(1) "did so" isn't appropriate for "suffer from depression"; you should reserve "do so" for ACTIONS, not passive conditions.

(2) there is a significant shift of meaning: the original sentence describes the percentage of the overall population that suffered depression, but this wording refers to how often (i.e., what percent of the time) people suffer depression.
e.g.
20% of my women friends are pregnant --> this makes sense: 1/5 of my female friends are pregnant.
my women friends are pregnant 20% of the time --> this doesn't make sense; it indicates that pregnancy is an on/off sort of condition that is "on" about 1/5 of the time (!!).

in this sentence, both of the above interpretations would make sense -- it's possible for x% of the population to be depressed (in general), and it's also possible for people to suffer from depression x% of the time. however, since the former meaning is explicit and clear in the original, you have to stick to that.

[surya.kamal48]

My first post in MGMAT FORUM!!!!!
I know the OA is A.
In option A six percent had become depressed by age twenty-four
I wanted to understand how come a six percent can become depressed? Can percentage suffer from depression???
I know its really bad to question the OA But I am wanted to understand why my logic is going wrong.Please explain